Swinger pools press release Tuesday 1st.

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3 weeks 5 days ago #795576 by Dave Scott
Swinger pools press release Tuesday 1st. was created by Dave Scott
TAB-TABGOLD MEDIA RELEASE

SUBJECT: Swinger pools commingled with UK Tote

DATE: Monday 31 August July 2020

RELEASED BY: Phumelela Gaming


TAB and TABgold are delighted to announce that all Swinger pools on UK races will be commingled with the UK Tote from this Tuesday 1 September.

SA-based Swinger pools on UK races currently average some R2,500 but TAB and TABgold customers can look forward to much bigger pools going forward.

Commingling will enhance liquidity and make payouts more robust, enabling TAB customers to take bigger Swinger bets on UK races without significantly impacting dividends.

The UK Tote operates Swinger pools on all races in which six or more horses are carded. In the event of a field being reduced to four or five runners, there is only one Swinger payout which comprises the first two in any order.

The pool is refunded if there are less than four runners.

The R1 unit of betting for the Swinger remains unchanged and UK Tote rules for the bet are virtually identical to those in operation on SA-based Swinger pools.
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3 weeks 5 days ago #795591 by Thor
This used to be the case before. If I remember correctly the swinger is not so popular in the UK, and the pools were majority SA based anyway.
Also the payout limit of a small fraction of the total pool per single swinger bet due to the exchange rate differential, similar to the Aus jackpots. But this is not mentioned.

A step backward, rather than fixing the cause of the poor local pools.
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3 weeks 4 days ago #795597 by mikesack
Welcome to more poor payouts.

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3 weeks 4 days ago #795598 by TNaicker
The mysterious Aussie punter has moved to the UK...:whistle: :unsure: :(

Will result in even weirder swinger results...

Life's too short to have a long face...so, cherish the good, learn from the bad and forget the rest...

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3 weeks 4 days ago #795604 by naresh
As Thor, mentioned before, they tried it before and to me it never work as they will have wanted. You will now see carry over swingers but with percentages caught. We are going to have strange payouts. I really like playing swingers in those heritage handicaps where you have maximum fields of 20 or more.

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3 weeks 4 days ago - 3 weeks 4 days ago #795662 by L J
Can Tab/Tabgold please advise how the below is now "Value"? A R1.00 swinger payout for the first and second favourite, R1.80 and R1.90 payouts with the third favourite. Wow almost as bad as playing local fancied swingers now. This rarely happened before with our local pooIs. I use to actually look forward to playing the swinger bets in the UK because of the value it would hold before this commingled rubbish. Eg. Yesterday on a race in Southwell, I placed a swinger bet on the first and second favourite(looked obvious on paper) which returned a fair R2.20 dividend. When I compared the dividend with the UK Tote it returned a mere R1.30. Sadly I will no longer be playing the swinger bet on UK Racing anymore due to these horrible dividends which occur through commingling. Please expect a lot more of R1.00 dividends for fancied horses going forward.


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Last edit: 3 weeks 4 days ago by L J.
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3 weeks 4 days ago #795666 by Thor
Those dividends are a joke and pathetic. You'd get at least R2 with local pools. All this has done was give the UK guys a chance to eat away all the value local players had. A quick look at the pool size suggests it wasn't much bigger than our local quartet pool on the race, so who exactly is benefitting here??? DO AWAY WITH THIS NOW. There is a reason the concept failed before, not sure who the person is that thought they happened upon a brilliant idea here.
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3 weeks 4 days ago - 3 weeks 4 days ago #795667 by Thor
Check the amazing value for the returns on Ripon race 2. For those that punted the race and know what an open race it was.
Last edit: 3 weeks 4 days ago by Thor.
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3 weeks 3 days ago #795783 by Thor
What amazing payouts wow I feel like having R10 000 on a swinger now with the large pools.

WN 1 4.40
PL 1 1.70
PL 7 1.30
SW 1-7 1.20
SW 1-3 1.10
SW 3-7 1.00

EX 1-7 9.90

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3 weeks 3 days ago - 3 weeks 3 days ago #795785 by L J

Thor wrote: What amazing payouts wow I feel like having R10 000 on a swinger now with the large pools.

WN 1 4.40
PL 1 1.70
PL 7 1.30
SW 1-7 1.20
SW 1-3 1.10
SW 3-7 1.00

EX 1-7 9.90


Could not agree with you more Thor!

As I stated yesterday, expect alot more R1.00 payouts for swingers in the UK going forward. This is the norm with commingling. It does not take a rocket scientist to figure this one out. When will they ever learn? :(
Last edit: 3 weeks 3 days ago by L J.

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3 weeks 3 days ago #795786 by Thor
@Bob Brogan, any chance of the tote responding here?

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3 weeks 3 days ago - 3 weeks 3 days ago #795797 by Thor
Top 3 will pays for Wolves race 6.
1 - 10 1.10
1 - 11 1.20
10 - 11 1.30

Who are the mugs in the UK playing this? Do they get betting rebates? I certainly will never ever play a swinger in the UK again. Even if you spot value in the will pays, there is a final large update to the pool from the UK late at the off that wipes out any value. The only South Africans I can see playing the swinger now are those that don't realize the impact of the commingling and will learn the hard way eventually. In this race, risking all that money for a 1/10 payout with the 10 to 1 second favourite swinger. The horse runs out the first 3 and boom all that money is lost. Risk and reward is definitely not matched here.
Last edit: 3 weeks 3 days ago by Thor.
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3 weeks 3 days ago #795799 by Pirhobeta
It doesn't make sense that a multiple bet pays less...than an individual place...but don't worry...after chasing more people away, they will realise it...
I also cannot understand the concept of pools changing after the off...surely all bets thereafter are null and void...if it cannot be processed timeously...it cannot be processed...WTF
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3 weeks 3 days ago #795800 by Bob Brogan
Will ask for a response, but you can’t just choose the smallest pools to highlight.

Also the UK tote will explode when punters are allowed back on course.

There are very few tote shops in the U.K.

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3 weeks 3 days ago #795801 by Pirhobeta
Greed...as usual is the driver...and the downfall...:whistle:

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3 weeks 3 days ago #795807 by Thor

Bob Brogan wrote: Will ask for a response, but you can’t just choose the smallest pools to highlight.

Also the UK tote will explode when punters are allowed back on course.

There are very few tote shops in the U.K.


Bob, the pools with the R1 dividends are the easiest to use to highlight the impact of the commingling. The other pools offer higher minimum dividends, but they're also no value for the prices of the favourites. Example two 5/1 favs paying R2.5 to R3 a swinger. May appear better on paper than a R1 dividend but the value is not there. I'm sure you get the point I'm making here. Take it from someone that played the UK swingers often, there has been a MARKED decrease in the value around. Most on here can see that.

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3 weeks 3 days ago - 3 weeks 3 days ago #795809 by L J

Thor wrote:

Bob Brogan wrote: Will ask for a response, but you can’t just choose the smallest pools to highlight.

Also the UK tote will explode when punters are allowed back on course.

There are very few tote shops in the U.K.


Bob, the pools with the R1 dividends are the easiest to use to highlight the impact of the commingling. The other pools offer higher minimum dividends, but they're also no value for the prices of the favourites. Example two 5/1 favs paying R2.5 to R3 a swinger. May appear better on paper than a R1 dividend but the value is not there. I'm sure you get the point I'm making here. Take it from someone that played the UK swingers often, there has been a MARKED decrease in the value around. Most on here can see that.


100% agreed Thor. I play much more on UK racing than SA Racing on a daily basis. As you stated previously, they once tried this commingling before and it never worked for this precise reason, the value was gone. Once more, the value is gone. The poor old R6 punter at the tote will now have to bear the brunt of receiving R1.00 payouts as opposed to at least doubling his investment when we had local pools. I can point out numerous instances where we had so much value with local pools as opposed to this commingling. It does not make any sense or logic anymore to take this bet now that there is commingling. It has killed the swinger bet completely on UK Racing. I used to previously spread my bets over the swinger, trifecta and quartet on UK Racing and on countless occasions the swinger bets would save me because I enjoy playing around the fancied combinations and almost always it comes in and I at least double my money. Alot of the time, the trifecta and quartet bets are harder to win because getting the exact order right is challenging, the swinger was my cover play to get my full investment back when I did not strike either the trifecta or quartet. Now I am forced to bet on the trifecta & quartet bet only because the swinger bet offers zero value and I have no way of covering up any money should I not get the exact combinations correct. I am highly disappointed in their decision to commingle. I really do hope more punters make a fuss about this, the punters always seem to get the short end of the stick and its frustrating.
Last edit: 3 weeks 3 days ago by L J.

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2 weeks 4 days ago #796200 by Thor
Swept under the rug?

My spend on swingers have dropped to zero. Can we get stats on the SA component of swinger pools pre and post this brainwave?

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1 week 3 days ago #796856 by Thor
WN 6 1.50
PL 1 1.60
PL 6 1.00
SW 1-6 1.00
SW 2-6 1.10
SW 1-2 1.40

EX 6-1 3.10
TF 6-1-2 4.30
QT 6-1-2-4 16.30

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1 week 3 days ago #796865 by L J

Thor wrote: WN 6 1.50
PL 1 1.60
PL 6 1.00
SW 1-6 1.00
SW 2-6 1.10
SW 1-2 1.40

EX 6-1 3.10
TF 6-1-2 4.30
QT 6-1-2-4 16.30


I feel your pain Thor however I feel like we are engaging ourselves in a futile exercise here, the tote clearly does not care about their customers ie. us. We have already given them ample time to respond to our concerns but we have been totally ignored. The only way to fix this is for SA punters to totally boycott the swinger bet in the UK. I would love to see how much of their turnover on the swinger bet is actually coming from SA now. I am pretty sure most punters have now stopped investing in this bet due to the ridiculous low payouts. If they haven't yet, I am confident they will soon stop in the near future once they realise how pathetic this commingling on the UK Swinger is.

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